Poor ITV1, and indeed poor Millionaire – as much as I like the revamp, clearly quite a few people (such as myself) don’t like it enough to actually watch it week on week, last night’s was down half a million on the series opener a fortnight ago. But the big question is this: if you were to axe Millionaire, what do you put in its place? Odd One In and Magic Numbers aren’t doing the business on Saturday nights (although I think at least one of those is because Saturday nights is completely the wrong place for them). Even Bother’s Bar non-favourite The Colour of Money could pull in bigger figures than Millionaire currently is. And that was rubbish.
So what I’m basically leading up to is this: why doesn’t ITV try Survivor again? Back when it was shown on British TV ten years ago, it would happily pull in 5-6m viewers – at the time, the low side of solid, despite actually being a great show (albeit much slower paced than necessary). In 2010, those are big hit numbers.
Of course, there are no guarantees that it would pull the same numbers in 2010. But it remains a solid performer around the world years after it was first unleashed. It’s clearly got something going for it.
There are of course things to object about. What if people associate Survivor 2010 with the abject failure of Survivor 2001? Then just call it Expedition Robinson. Survivor UK reportedly cost £10m to make which is a huge amount in this day and age. But to that I say “don’t emulate the Americans, have a word with Strix (Swedish), Adventure Line (French) or Talpa (did the Netherlands/Belgian one for a bit) to see how they make a successful long-running show on evidently a much smaller budget. Fewer massive set pieces, more grit.”
Could it work?
If I did axe the show then I wouldn’t put a game show in it’s place. Simply to say Tuesday nights on ITV1 is a total graveyard. Ever since Champions League moved from Tuesday to Wednesday in 2008, the timeslots between 8pm and 10pm have been a flop zone.
I heard whispers that the executives at ITV didn’t want the revamp to take place and I can see why. Three shows in and they are giving away more money compared to the last couple of series.
I don’t think Survivor would get 5 million now. When Challenge bought the US season, nobody was watching it but that was largely down to them airing it every night. I just don’t think the UK viewing public will be interested with it. Which is probably why Shipwrecked was on T4 and not in primetime.
Interestingly, I never realised how well the French version rated (scroll down):
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koh-lanta
The third series of The Vault in 2004 aired in the Tuesday 8pm slot, and despite Karen Shand winning a million from the comfort of her armchair, it didn’t appear to get the viewing figures that ITV wanted – as suggested by the fact that they cut one episode from the end of the run.
Could this have been a foreshadowing?
That said, would Duel work if they had a higher profiled host than Nick Hancock and tweaked the rules a bit?
It may well have been better if they did the modified rules at the beginning.
I can’t believe they never thought that they’d be giving away increasingly large amounts of consolation cash as no-one won the jackpot through.
duel didnt rate all that badly did it? i thought it did quite well.
Duel’s audience rose over the series, and though on it’s own it’s figures didn’t look too great (around 3.5m IIRC), when compared to other new shows on ITV at the time and Millionaire itself, it really should have got a second chance to see if it could establish itself, especially as it was well received amongst those who watched it.
This all being said, I’ve just read something on DS suggesting that 71 Degrees North will begin on Tuesday 14th September. So maybe it’s all moot.
They must have no faith in it, if they’re putting it there. Can’t remember the last time, they had anything near 4m in that slot.
Duel would work at 8 on a Tuesday (I’d even run it on a Sunday as well for the first couple of weeks to build up a bit of audience) but, yes, (sorry Nick – even though I was the only one who laughed at one of your jokes during a bit of a between take banter when I went to see it) we do need a new higher profile host (and not the usual bargin bucket rent-a-show ITV regulars) and I don’t think the progressive thru-series jackpot is the way to go – keep it to the single episode.
So, start the show with £5,000 in the jackpot – add £1,000 for every chip blown during the game. Reduce the number of chips from 10 to 8. Winner stays on, and has to keep winning the games all through the show. Winner of last game of the episode, takes home the pot. Keep each game to a part and take break at the colclusion of every game, there would be 4 games per show – jackpot would be around £20,000 – £25,000 per show. ITV would swallow that.
Yes, I know there are two ‘n’s in conclusion….
I assume it’s possible to do Survivor on a tight budget, as Fox in Serbia have done it, and there’s not a huge amount of money floating around there. I get the impression a lot of countries’ series are done on sets built by the Dutch or Swedes, and the challenges are mainly ones they used, and I don’t see a problem with that at all. Much like Total Wipeout.
If they don’t want to do Survivor, how about Peking Express? I’ve heard a lot of good things about that show…
The Amazing Race with more hitchhiking. I didn’t think all that much of what I’ve seen of it.
Has anyone ever heard anything about the BBCs take on ‘The amazing Race’ with Steve Jones.
I’m sure they filmed it.
Mmm, Drop Zone. Not a clue. Perhaps it’s the BBC’s 2010 answer to Press Ganged.
or they are reserving it for 5.30pm in the autumn. They need something to replace Hole in the Wall.
Or anouther series of UK boyard?
I still think it should be Solitary UK. That show would do so well when BBUK finishes it’s course
Wow, I completely forgot that the German version has been going on since mid-July… has anyone been following that at all?
No, and coming from a huge fan like me, that’s bad
itv should buy the rights to the amazing race, even australia is getting their own local version.
Would Amazing Race would cost more than Survivor to produce? I do think there’s enough space for ITV to bring back the Survivor brand – at least once. Just don’t do it with 12 people, and get them to ally properly, this time.
I’d really rather hope for a Survivor UK remake.
From what I know of the US version, Amazing Race is extremely expensive to produce, based on all the last-minute air fares they have to buy.
next point, flicking through next weeks radio times, there is the arrival of series 4 of ‘Escape From Scorpion Island’ (which incidently is a show that cant be on a ridiculously high budget seeing as its from the kids department.)
New series, new timeslot, daily on cbbc. Big suprise? the new host: Myleene Klass. Her agent has clearly dropped the ball since landing her american I’m a Celeb.
and checking out the website, its been on for a week already.
Top of the Klass for 2011, surely.
Well the question is; how do ITV feel about quizzes in primetime?
‘Millionaire’ is the only one left and they seem reticent to commission pure quiz formats for evening slots – whereas BBC One still plod along with Saturday night Lottery quizzes that are cheap to make and seem to get an audience.
There is something quite perverse about something like The Chase, being as quizzy and brainy as it is, playing in daytime – but nothing on the same intellectual level in primetime. Does this mean they think their daytime audience is more intelligent than their primetime audience?
If ‘Millionaire’ keeps at these figures it’s going to get another series, if not two. It’s great numbers for a midweek quiz whichever way you look at it. But when it goes (and it’s a ‘when’, not an ‘if’) – if it’s not replaced by a quiz then that represents a kind of new era for quizzing on British TV. If the largest commercial channel don’t support quizzing in primetime then that signifies a big shift in the game show genre.
I guess the issue for commissioners is scale, and I do sympathise with their predicament. The talent shows feel SO huge, not just tonally – but physically huge. This is why you get things like The Whole 19 Yards and 101 Ways… popping up. Channels still *want* to like quiz – but need it grafting onto something else to feel like visually more impressive propositions.
If I were them the only quiz format not on British TV at the moment that I’d be looking at is 1 vs 100 – more specifically the US version. The set and the mob of 100 still feels like a ‘big deal’. On ITV they could simplify the Lottery version rules to offer 1 Million (a ‘big deal’) and they could get back Dermot to host to give it some X Factor cross-synergising (I heard that term in 30 Rock so I’m gonna run with it).
But then it was originally on BBC One…
Re: ‘Survivor’; I don’t think so. Firstly, the format is owned by a company ITV haven’t worked with for years. Secondly; the new ITV are obsessed with BRANDS. Survivor runs the risk of stepping on the toes of one of the channels flagship brands (‘I’m a Celeb’). As a format, Survivor doesn’t allow for much brand extension or cross-fertilisation with other programmes (take ‘Jedward’ for example; they start on X Factor, get a ob-doc series on ITV2, and are now lined up for I’m Celeb) – Survivor is played by nobody members of the public (“boring!”) and the hosts role is minimal.
I’ve just waffled on about nothing for 5 paragraphs – sorry about.
“about nothing”? That strikes me as pretty insightful analysis!
Mmm yes, food for thought, although I have some issues which I shall attempt to articulate later.
For the record, the main Survivor programmes in 2001 averaged about 6.3m viewers. That’s excluding Survivor Update and Survivor Unseen, but including weekend repeats of four episodes. The 2002 series with its Incredible Moving Start Time (billed for 9.45, starting anywhere between 9.44 and 10.07) averaged almost exactly 5m. Figures for the two series are not directly comparable. Both series were generally placed around 20th on ITV’s list of shows; the spring 2010 equivalent is about 3.4m.
Let me take a holistic approach to this, and point out the elephant in the room. ITV’s reliance on soap operas (Emmerdale, Coronation Street, previously The Bill) and football (most Wednesday nights from mid-August to early May) mean there aren’t many primetime weekday slots available for serial game shows, or anything else. 9pm Monday, 7.30 and 8pm Tuesday, 9pm Thursday, 8.30 and 9 Friday nights, and now 9pm Tuesday.
Would Survivor fit into ITV’s proposition? What *is* ITV’s proposition these days? Mass appeal programming, something that is of interest to anyone from 10 to 40, 60, 80. Harry Hill, Saturday Night Takeaway from a few years ago, all the soap operas, I’m a Celebrity.
And there’s the rub. I’m a Celeb clearly owes a lot to Survivor, and so long as it remains popular, I think it will be difficult for ITV to run Survivor as we know it. That’s not to say Survivor wouldn’t work on another channel, but that ITV would find it very difficult to justify running it.
Would a civilian version of I’m a Celeb be possible and desirable? Possible, certainly, almost anything can be done on telly. Only having votes to evict, challenges that last longer than ten minutes and are entertaining in their own right (something Big Brother has had this year), it’s possible. Desirable? It’s twenty shows maximum, perhaps spun out over four weeks. They might try it (June to early July looks possible) but it’s not a long-term solution.
As Sphil has pointed out, Escape from Scorpion Island contains the germ of a show for adults. Not only is it tolerably cheap (though note the BBC show is a co-production with ABC Australia), but it’s got an interesting format. It produces a winning *team*, not individuals, and the team composition changes from time to time. The Great British Public will accept a winning team, but show producers seem not to like chopping the reds and yellows as time passes. Exception: Shipwrecked, which was almost the antithesis of Survivor – no foraging for food, parties and barbecues laid on each week, and people arriving rather than departing. It was a T4 show because it cast young twentysomethings.
If not ITV, where would New Survivor fit on the television landscape? Falls between the holes of the BBC channels, too populist for BBC2, neither mass appeal nor public service for BBC1, too expensive for BBC3, utterly off-base for BBC4. Channel 4 doesn’t pick up cast-offs, that’s Channel 5’s job, though they seem to have set their eyes on Big Brother. Could fit onto The Satellite Channel, but they’d completely mess it up. It’s too ambitious for UKTV Watch, but might – just – squeeze into UKTV Dave’s remit.
And besides, weren’t we agitating for Return of The Mole?
ive been pondering the itv soap-scape for a while actually. with effectively an hour of a two hour primetime hole gone each week day, it leaves very little space to be creative. My thoughts: try and sell of emmerdale to sky. For itv, it would bring in both much needed money (and if their clever about the sale, rent from the studios!) and free up space in primetime, and sky will have an established ratings pull, and a soap opera, which i would put money on them loving.
I did also ponder moving the early evening news, but moving it into the now established 5 o’clock game show hole would be counter productive, seeing as adult viewers only have bbc 2 itv and channel 4 to choose from (disregarding c5 as a viable contender yet! a possible move to a seven o clock hole is better, seeing as the 6 o clock hole isnt competitive at all really, but with one hour of news remit to put out 7-8 is far too prime time. Unless (and i dont know the psb rules) the early evening could be shortened to half an hour, and either lunchtime or late news extended (i can see 10-11 of news being alright, just shove on a movie at 11, sorted!) i wouldnt move anything. So now with an hour and half primetime over and above the hallowed corrie, it gives far more creative space.
it allows for hour long dramas of the cold feet ilk, or low and behold, an american import. Who knows, maybe itv could try their hand at comedy!!!
There is also a tantalising half hour gap at 7 o clock, which sound perfect for game show content.
oh and, in reference to a proposed ‘the mole’ comeback. am i the only person who thinks it would sit brilliantly on the bbc (either channel) in the apprentice slot in the off season?
I certainly don’t think it’s very ITV1.
They (The Beeb) sort of tried a ‘Mole’ type show with ‘The Murder Game’. Sadly, it was a flop ratings wise from what I remember.
And then they tried to revive The Mole over in the USA and that didn’t really get off the ground again due to poor ratings, although I enjoyed it…
The Murder Game, I remember that! Based on Murder In Small Town X. And was shown in possibly the worst possible slot they could’ve shown it.
Under the current public service broadcasting arrangements, ITV must air a 30-minute news bulletin in its prime-time. ITV defines prime-time to be 7pm-11pm. It must also air news bulletins in each region. If ITV were to axe local news, and other public service commitments, it would be likely to lose its position at 3 (103) in the EPG, which is generally seen as a major disadvantage.
I don’t think ITV would be likely to air imported series before News At Ten: BBC1 has made a commitment not to do that, and with the exception of Pushing Dasies, ITV hasn’t shown an import for many years.
Im not saying what i suggested is likely in any universe, its just what i’d do with them. Because i think we all agree itv needs a reboot.
It has been said time and time again ITV should just pick up The Crystal Maze and be done with it.
Survivor io doubt they would go there again, i also suspect if Solitary does get picked up it will be CH4 or maybe even Living that give it a shot.
Drop Zone was meant to be filmed over the summer, i would imagine to air in the spring if it did go ahead.
Would be nice to see some prime time Saturday night Millionaire again, maybe if they had tried that instead of colouring their money…
Oh sorry I forgot all prime time Saturday night parking spaces are reserved under the surname ‘Cowell’ for most of the year. Carry on then.
Well he is successful with an undeniable track record, in fairness. If I was in charge of a commercial TV company and had the choice of a 10m rating show or a 3m rating show, I’m going for Simon Cowell as well.